Ex-CIA Pilot Gives Sworn Testimony That No Planes Hit The Twin Towers

feature image number oneNeon Nettle – by Ron Baitley-Simens

A former CIA and civilian pilot has sworn an affidavit, stating that no planes flew into the Twin Towers as it would have been physically impossible.

John Lear, the son of Learjet inventor, Bill Lear, has given his expert evidence that it would have been physically impossible for Boeing 767s, like Flights AA11 and UA175 to have hit the Twin Towers on 9/11, particularly when flown by inexperienced pilots:  

‘No Boeing 767 airliners hit the Twin Towers as fraudulently alleged by the government, media, NIST and its contractors’, he stated in the affidavit.

‘Such crashes did not occur because they are physically impossible as depicted, for the following reasons: in the case of UAL 175 going into the south tower, a real Boeing 767 would have begun ‘telescoping’ when the nose hit the 14 inch steel columns which are 39 inches on center.

‘The vertical and horizontal tail would have instantaneously separated from the aircraft, hit the steel box columns and fallen to the ground.

‘The engines when impacting the steel columns would havemaintained their general shape and either fallen to the ground or been recovered in the debris of the collapsed building.

‘No Boeing 767 could attain a speed of 540 mph at 1000 feet above sea level ‘parasite drag doubles with velocity’ and ‘parasite power’ cubes with velocity.

  • The fan portion of the engine is not designed to accept the volume of dense air at that altitude and speed.
  • The piece of alleged external fuselage containing 3 or 4 window cutouts is inconsistent with an airplane that hit 14 inch steel box columns, placed at over 500 mph.  It would have crumpled.
  • No significant part of the Boeing 767 or engine could have penetrated the 14 inch steel columns and 37 feet beyond the massive core of the tower without part of it falling to the ground.

‘The debris of the collapse should have contained massive sections of the Boeing 767, including 3 engine cores weighing approximately 9000 pounds apiece which could not have been hidden. Yet there is no evidence of any of these massive structural components from either 767 at the WTC. Such complete disappearance of 767s is impossible.

The affidavit, dated 28th January 2014 is part of a law suit being pursued byMorgan Reynolds in the United States District Court, Southern District, New York.

In March 2007, Reynolds, a former chief economist under the George W Bush administration filed a Request For Correction with the US National Institute of Science and Technology citing his belief that real commercial jets (Boeings) did not hit the WTC towers.

Although the 9/11 Truth movement initially rejected the ‘no-planes’ theory as too outlandish, after scientific and rational analysis, it has become a widely accepted explanation of the evidence collected.

feature image number two

Unlike any other form of statement, an affidavit becomes truth in law, if it is not rebutted.  It will now be up to critics of the theory to present their evidence and analysis to rebut the statement point by point.  If they do not – or cannot – then the US government will be obliged to admit that the account given by the 9/11 Commission is wrong.

The 65 year old retired airline captain and former CIA pilot – who has over 19,000 hours of flight time — also drew attention to the inexperience of the pilots who allegedly flew the planes:

‘The alleged ‘controlled’ descent into New York on a relatively straight course by a novice pilot in unlikely in the extreme because of the difficulty of controlling heading, descent rate and descent speed within the parameters of ‘controlled’ flight.

‘It takes a highly skilled pilot to interpret the “EFIS” (Electronic Flight Instrument Display) display, with which none of the hijacker pilots would have been familiar or received training on, and use his controls, including the ailerons, rudder, elevators, spoilers and throttles to effect, control and maintain a descent.

Lear has, according to his sworn statement, flown over 100 different types of planes during his 40 years of flying and holds more FAA airman certificates than any other FAA certificated airman. He flew secret missions for the CIA in Southeast Asia, Eastern Europe, the Middle East and Africa between 1967 and 1983 then spent 17 years working for several passenger and cargo airlines as Captain, Check Airman and Instructor.

He is a member of Pilotfor911truth.org, which has consistently shown that it was impossible for jet airliners to have hit the Twin Towers in the way the 9/11 Commission has suggested.

The Commission did not take evidence from experts or pilots when it conducted its enquiry into the attacks from 2002 to 2004.



75 thoughts on “Ex-CIA Pilot Gives Sworn Testimony That No Planes Hit The Twin Towers

  1. This info was taken from the second edition of “Planes without Passengers” by Dean T. Hartwell. The following points represent what I consider to be the best of his evidence in favor of the no-planes argument.

    1) In November of 2003, investigator Gerard Holmgren, now deceased, announced that the Bureau of Transportation Statistics did not list flights 11 and 77 as flying on September 11, 2001. Oopsie! The BTS maintained that stance until retroactively changing it in 2004.

    2) Even more damning: The two planes that were officially listed as flying that day – flights 175 & 93 – were detected by their message signals (according to pilots for 9/11 truth) AFTER they had supposedly crashed. The message system is called “ACARS, for Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System.” ACARS records put flight #175 hundreds of miles west of the WTC (in Pennsylvania) at the time of the alleged crash, 9:03am. The last ACARS communication for flight 175 was received at 9:23am over Pittsurgh, PA. Similarly, ACARS records put flight 93 over Champaign, Illinois, at 10:10am. Flight #93 was alleged to have crashed in Pennsylvania between 10:03-10:10am.

    3) There was no evidence proffered of any of the putative planes at any of the crash sites, despite the myriad of individually numbered (for easy id after a crash) plane parts.

    4) Similarly, no evidence was provided of any of the remains of any of the putative plane passengers at any of the crash sites. All we have is the gov’t word – no independent verification. And there was a decided lack of proper “chain of custody” for the evidence brought forth.

    5) Phone calls to relatives either not possible (no cell phone coverage at putative altitude, no airphones on at least one of the planes) or nonsensical (‘Mom? This is Mark Bingham…’ etc.). Witness reports of receipt of passenger calls contradicted by available phone records (e.g., Ted Olson’s report of wife Barbara’s calls).

    6) No passenger manifests or airport security video were produced to confirm that even one of the alleged hijackers was on any of the relevant flights that morning. All we have to support the idea of hijackers are the phony phone calls.

    7) Not one pilot of any of the “hijacked” planes took the few seconds to punch in a “hijacked” alarm signal code as they decidedly would done had they been hijacked. In one case, the cockpit had not even been breached (according to the official story), so the pilots certainly had time to punch in the code.

    8) Video fakery (that ‘nose-out’ frame is especially damning). Here’s a link to some short videos posted on JF’s site:


    9) Simple physics – what would happen to real (non-virtual) airplanes hitting a steel building? They would be crushed on the outside of the building. End of story.

    10) More basic physics – the planes (or missiles) could not have flown at the putative speed (500mph) at that altitude. Not physically possible! (If I recall, the max speed at that altitude of the WTC “impacts” was 360mph for those models of planes.)

    What happened to the passengers? Not sure, but Hartwell has some good guesses. Anyway, as Sherlock Holmes “said” : “…when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth”. It’s not up to him or me or anyone else to pin down every detail – it’s enough to demolish the official story.

  2. How is it that we have it all on film ?
    And that thousands witnessed the events ?
    The only explanation I can think of is …..
    Holograms being projected and timed to the
    explosions. To give the illusion of the event happening.
    Then there’s the problem of Where are the passengers ?
    Were they flown to remote bases and executed ?
    The actual planes could have been remarked and
    absorbed into the fleet, so that’s easy to explain.
    New theories bring with them new questions…..

    1. Your hologram theory makes sense, Paraclete. However, a hologram requires the coordination of three lasar projections (x/y/z) in order to create a 3D image in motion. Not impossible, but there would be obvious distortions from a moving object, verses a stationary object. Perhaps, holography technology is far more advanced then we realize?

  3. Darling Funny,
    My arguments were taken from a book that lists more than one point. I listed the most important points. One of them mentioned a report. So you are attacking the entire argument based on this one point. Gosh that seems illogical.

    Now you’re having a go at ME. That is ad hominem. Yes, I’ve been around here a while. How long have you been commenting? Either way, it’s irrelevant to the argument at hand.

    Do you think that a passenger jet also hit the Pentagon? I’ve read your posts, many of which I agree with, but now I’m becoming curious how your mind really works.

  4. If they can get people onboard with this theory, then they can truly discredit us. Disinformation is the name of the game. The videos have been played back frame by frame millions of times and no glich in the “hologram” found? Sorry I’m not buying this. No offense to anyone that believes it. Hell, go back a few years and most would still think hijackers were actually flying the planes. The bottom line is the government was behind it. It doesn’t really matter how they came down. It just matters who did it.
    We have bigger fish to fry when Connecticut starts trying to arrest Patriots.

      1. .,
        Just my opinion, but the US corp., Israhell, Britts., and probably several others. I’m not here to start an argument over how the towers were destroyed. We all have to make our own minds up. The enemy is still the same.

        1. exactly
          don’t lose sight of the fact(im not inferring you are) ..they already made their move, this home front is and has already been attacked.. and we are being continually attacked since, but in smaller degrees, completely planned and so far we arnt doing much to stop them.
          so many people a sleep, so many unsure after being awoken as to what to do, and who to do it too and when
          the psy ops games that have been played before that time and there after is a complete orchestration of events completely on purpose, completely on target, and moving forward at an alarming rate as of to date.
          Our Republic has been over run, those sitting in Gov positions are plants, or are being blackmailed because they are so corrupt. If there is no direct intervention , this Country’s founding government will perish, and so will may of us.

  5. I can see this discussion going south really fast. You don’t need a Doctorates degree in Physics to see that the official 911 Commission story is badly flawed. I will post just one source of video that shows plausible deniability regarding the “No Planes” assertions.


    In closing I wish to point out one similarity between 911 and Sandy Hook: None of the names of the alleged passengers on the 4-planes that disappeared on 911, nor the people killed at Sandy Hook, appear in the Social Security Death Index… but they were “allegedly” killed.


  6. 9/11 commission= Warren commission= same circus = commission of lies and crime cover up= FACT

  7. John Lear is a wealthy, nausiating schizoid who promotes every false notion and idea ( conspiracy theory ) that his warped mind can conceive and then promotes it as fact. That is, (i.e.) every idea EXCEPT FREEDOM!!!! The man has no credibility and is working to PREVENT the restoration of this REPUBLIC. This man does not care about FREEDOM, it’s that simple.

    1. One of THE top pilots in the world speaks on a subject that he is more familiar with than the vast majority of the people on this planet, and YOU claim he has NO CREDIBILITY???

      What exactly, may I ask, are YOUR credentials? How many flying hours have YOU logged?

      Of the two of you, you’re the one that has ZERO credibility with a statement of that nature. In fact, that sounds to me EXACTLY what a (so-called) ‘government’ troll would say, in a pitiful attempt to discredit the truth.

      That being the case, I’m calling this one:

      TROLL ALERT!!!

      And this is what we think of trolls in this neighborhood:

      ……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
      ……….”…\………. _.·´

      Kick rocks, clownboy.

      1. And I second that #1. Love that finger. If I had that he would get a second one just like you gave him.
        Yes #1, there has been a lot of tolls around lately and I also agree with your troll alert.

        1. thats easy just copy paste hehe
          ……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
          ……….”…\………. _.·´

          1. Awe man lostwoodradio, I do not mean to sound ignorant or dumb but I do not know how to copy/paste. Every time I try something like that or anything to do with anything electrical I am a real screw up. Yep, no foolin. 😉

    2. J&P — Your smoke & mirrors won’t work here. You aren’t presenting anything but your baseless, rhetorical opinion.

      This is a freedom of speech zone but as the saying goes: unsupported opinions are like assholes… everyone has one.

  8. I totally agree. What motivates these people to lie? He throws this crazy story out there so that anyone else seeking the truth (as in W Bush simply letting 9-11 happen so the Patriot Act and Homeland Security could be born) are made to look like fools. What amazes me is all the live news camera’s that recorded the attack that morning is simply ignored by this crackpot. Anyway …whoever planned 9-11 was successful because today we have the Nazi goon patrol (Dept of Homeland Security) waiting in the wings with their 4 billion rounds of ammo. The Patriot Act in full swing and our police force have become militant thugs that shoot people for non compliance.

  9. FF- This is what Mike Rivero and his little toady, Rye Dawson, have been saying for years… with no rational explanation of how these Planes, with giant titanium engine hulls were vaporized by the heat of kerosene/benzene fuel (which doesn’t burn anywhere near hot enough to melt steel, let alone titanium). How did the entire plane disappear into that tiny hole in the Pentagon without shearing-off the wings and tail section? Furthermore, how does the delicate, forward edge of the Plane wing cut through the steel columns of the Twin Towers like butter (or a Bugs Bunny cartoon leaving the outline of the plane)?

    I can’t understand why these minor statistics are above your head, and that after almost 13-years we are still getting into pissing contests over these f**king planes.

    The facts show that planes could NOT have crashed into the Towers or the Pentagon. Until people can logically answer the simple question of thermodynamics, and how an elephant passed through the eye of a needle… the facts will stand that there were no planes used in these “alleged” crashes. Explosives yes — Planes NO.

  10. Without a doubt they had some very high tech media production gear set up and ready with a master control somewhere controlling all the media. There is ample evidence of extremely high resolution video recordings from gear yet to be revealed in the public sector. Huge 12k??+ resolution video that can feed multiple cameras and make it look like more than one point of view. Take it for what you will, I can’t speak to planes but given the type of production gear involved it is entirely possible no planes were used. It was like having Hubble on the ground somewhere.

  11. no planes hit any buildings including the pent o gram if you did any research on this you would now and most certainly see how they pulled off this slight of hand trick not to mention for years prior they told you they were to demolish them just like the announcement of the phoney boston bombing it was announced as a drill many times
    you would also find that all planes listed as the ones who hit buildings that day where still flying years later and supposedly blown out of the sky
    you were deceived get over it those buildings were planned for demolition for five years prior and set up for it for that long
    go after the ones who staged the modern day riechstag fire and leave those alone who try show you the truth

  12. no planes hit any buildings including the pent o gram if you did any research on this you would now and most certainly see how they pulled off this slight of hand trick not to mention for years prior they told you they were to demolish them just like the announcement of the phoney boston bombing it was announced as a drill many times
    you would also find that all planes listed as the ones who hit buildings and supposedly blown out of the sky that day where still flying years later
    you were deceived get over it those buildings were planned for demolition for five years prior and set up for it for that long
    go after the ones who staged the modern day riechstag fire and leave those alone who try show you the truth

  13. Whatever. Who knows? At the end of the day we have three skyscrapers down in their own footprint with pools of molten iron in the basements bubbling away weeks after the event and a bunch of Israelis stationed off-site to “document the event”. And the “War on Terror” started. Cui bono?

  14. http://pilotsfor911truth.org/WTC2.html
    neither plane was taken off the active flight list till 2005 and only switched because someone pointed out hey if these two planes hit the trade center how can they still be used for flights for years following

    and it isn’t the first hoax here is one they didn’t run with but had ready to go

    lets not forget about building what 7

  15. yes to many fools believe the bs coming out of the tb the boob tube and the crown corporation posing as our government

  16. Funny Farmer, dot has been posting here for well over a year. She has very high credibility with myself, as well as many other posters on this site.

    Planes constructed of mainly aluminum, rubber and glass cannot simply slice through concrete and steel like a hot knife through warm butter. Why this simple fact of basic physics continues to elude so many is beyond me. It is no less impossible for that to occur than it is for a building to collapse in it’s own footprint – unaided.

    Those alleged ‘planes were holograms. In fact, so certain of this am I, that I would unhesitatingly literally bet my very life on that statement. Unequivocally.

    Would you be willing to say the same, so positive are you that they were ‘planes’?

  17. I just want to say that I for one have never been ALL IN on the no planes theory.
    pentagone-The passenger list for the pentagon had only two people on board who have been proven to actually exist. Oddly enough the pilot had just became a civilian pilot and was the first pilot to ever launch a cruise missile from a flying airplane while in the military.

    flight 93- within a year of 9-11 united spent millions to test in air cell service. Why spend all that money when cell phones worked so well on 9-11?

    nyc- 1 building was reported to have collapsed before it did(was never struck by a plane or any debris from the main towers as there was a building and two roads in the way) and the other two managed to atomize into a small pile at the base.

    would it surprise me to find no planes at all? NO.
    how do I reconcile the video and the people who saw the planes? well… one definition for the word magic is a technology or method that is not understood by the observer. So I say magic.

  18. I totally agree. It IS abundantly clear.

    Mainly because too many people don’t do any SERIOUS research on certain topics they think they know the truth about.

    1. I do not know about that . You may be a retired firfighter but there are just too many coincidences on that wtc thing like building #7 , those executives knew enough not to be their, the buildings were a perfect example of a demolition project, ect ect. I am no expert by any means, and I do not try to profess that I am a expert, but I am no dummy either ya know and things do not add up. Remember those so called maintanence people that were there for a week or two for no reason? I will say no more as #1 knows way way more than I do so I am sure he will get back to ya.
      What I said here to ya is just what I have heard from many different unrelated sources ya know so there ya have it. There are just way too many thing that do not add up with this world trade thing ya know Funny Farmer in all respect to ya if ya know what I`m sayin`.

    2. “On a side note, i personally witnessed the recovery of two of the jet engines, in which one was nearly fully intact and landed a block away.

      FULLY INTACT??? And you don’t see a serious problem with that?

      Yeah, that’s right, though. That would be the engine that witnesses’ saw dumped out of a white van.

      Personally, I don’t give a flying f%&k what you THINK you saw. The laws of physics are IMMUTABLE!!! You were just as deceived as were most of us.

      “what i did say was planes MOST CERTAINLY hit those buildings.. I witnessed it with my own eyes.

      Well, by golly, that’s EXACTLY what holograms are designed to do. Wouldn’t be much f%&king use if they DIDN’T look like the real deal now, would they.

      I have a friend who works in the movie industry. They were on the set the day that happened. Every single person in the special effects department said the same thing – that what those planes APPEARED to do could only be done with CG. Those people know special effects.

      As I stated, and I stand by that statement, I would LITERALLY BET MY LIFE that those so called ‘planes’ were holograms. This is not something I take lightly.

  19. In other words, we can all rest assured that the very laws of physics were suspended on that particular day specifically for ‘God’s (self-proclaimed) chosen’, by the Almighty Himself?

    m’kay. 🙄

  20. look…funny farmer….you came on to this site with too much of a bang to have me given you much credence…probably you are a fake…
    you better check your hole cards before you discredit regulars here who have stood the test of time…
    tell you something else about 911….structural engineers nearly 100 % dis believe it………..so check your hole card again……and be damned sure you report it here!!!!!!!

  21. let me tell you something funny farmer..
    i personally am a combat veteran of Viet nam drafted army 1968 in country 1969.. US56639487..a college grad before that…and a college fresh when JFK was killed and I listened over the radio live then…which then as a young person soon after believed our gov did it…still went into the draft cause if one did not it was off to jail…and I been around every since and your telling me….I am the reason we are lost.!!!there are many regulars on this site with comparable stories although i may be one of the oldest and no ONE HERE has there head in the sand…
    go back to where you came from cause it ain’t tak’in here..

  22. who knows and who cares cause it was all bullshit and could have been flown by remote or a non item……
    The incidental thing was phoney…..got it!!!

    1. fact have to add this…
      if you were there and you believe this
      I have grave questions to ask you do you want to participate? answer me!

  23. you know what funny farmer…I actually am a farmer…born in 1945 and attended a one room country school. 1-5 grades and rode horse back in so doing as did all the students…McCone County Montana…that was 1951-1955 and after that my dad was killed right in front of my own eyes…..i was 10 and one half..tractor over turned on him….and i was on the spot….and my life has gone on from there…Robert Beason Billings montana 59102
    and I have really no idea who you are…..

  24. Fact is …think that shut you up cause it’s the truth
    check out circle Banner …archives if there are any… Circle Montana
    Circle Banner….the local paper..
    I get so sick of people who are ….someone…
    when they would just say…here is who I am and this is what I think
    well there you have it on me…
    Not only was i born and raised on a farm…I worked them as an employee even after getting out of NAM in 1970 June….they are lovely places, truely, they are

  25. sorry funny farmer….and i think you are sincere..
    the key boards of the frontage….do none of us justice…
    when we are talking…be it you are i
    or the adm….of this site…
    so all of us are open to error…
    let us each be respectful of each other…
    and yes…those of myself…as identifying myself are correct and should any one else want they may contact Henry and ask…cause I believe a secret society begins with secret people..
    and our United States is a WOW far from that..We are not secret…
    so anyone wanting my email just ask Henry and he has my permission to give it out….
    he will probably ask it first….
    Of Me

  26. Agreed
    bring your thoughts…bring your posts to aid henry
    and bring your ideas in postings..
    and if we were closer..
    bring on the beer…
    and I can’t forget the music…
    FIRst bring on the music……….
    best my friend…

  27. I asked Henry to give you my email…
    if you would like…
    Your heart is so open, man……gracious….
    Hang,….you are for now in a good place and also your loved ones may be

    1. and you know what also that others who might read this…and they think they are out of the way….are subject to when one is and actually gets into war combat!..Its like this as taught to me…fu@k um all but, nine,six paul bearers ,two road guards and one to count cadence..
      Meaning kill every one else…but to get one self interred into the earth..
      my what a fine thing to TEACH THE young…
      thats the slogan even around the globe today.
      lets forget about when it happened to me 1968…age 23….
      Every one reading this must understand things have not changed…..
      God sakes defend your-self…
      robert beason billings montana US 56639487
      I challenge anyone to say i am not who I say I am///
      cause so much on the inet is fake…well, not me

  28. my thoughts on this is that you are sincere..funny farmer….
    so lets email(one another)something from this site i have not done…
    there are a bunch of regulars who’s comments might not do justice to the intent on this site…not to their detriment but to their lack of info..
    I find your thoughts…SAYING ….hey.,lets think

  29. You need the reality check, my friend. When John Lear, considered to be one of THE top pilots in the world, flatly states that not only could HE not have accomplished such a monumental (AND impossible) feat, but that neither could anyone else have done so, guess what? He has FAR more credibility with me than some person posting on the internet that I don’t know personally, as in, at least talked to on the phone. Angel, JD, NC, digger, REDHORSE, RT, Mark Schumacher and I have all talked on the phone, and I can say without reservation that every last one of them are stand-up patriots.

    You I don’t know from Adam.

    Apparently, you don’t appreciate the facts getting in the way of YOUR infallible conclusions.

    ” a real Boeing 767 would have begun ‘telescoping’ when the nose hit the 14 inch steel columns which are 39 inches on center.

    A REAL plane?

    “The vertical and horizontal tail would have instantaneously separated from the aircraft, hit the steel box columns and fallen to the ground.”

    Again, a REAL plane?

    “The fan portion of the engine is not designed to accept the volume of dense air at that altitude and speed.”

    REAL plane?

    “The piece of alleged external fuselage containing 3 or 4 window cutouts is inconsistent with an airplane that hit 14 inch steel box columns, placed at over 500 mph. It would have crumpled.”


    “The debris of the collapse should have contained massive sections of the Boeing 767, including 3 engine cores weighing approximately 9000 pounds apiece which could not have been hidden. Yet there is no evidence of any of these massive structural components from either 767 at the WTC. Such complete disappearance of 767s is impossible.”


    Don’t let the facts confuse you.

    And there is far more evidence than this. But of course, you haven’t seen it, so it can’t possibly exist.

    1. “…..and also because you read a “Testimony” that a cia agent gave !!! My friend you discredit yourself..”

      WTF??? Are you really stupid enough to try to claim that my claims are based on this article ALONE??? GIVE ME A F%&KING BREAK!!!!! I’VE KNOWN ABOUT THIS SH#T FOR TWO F%&KING YEARS NOW!!!!

      You know what, you’re seriously pissing me off with your stupidity, so guess what? I’ve got better things to do than waste my time with you, so we’re done here.


    2. Look up the HOMERUN system installed to allow remote takeover of flight controls in case of hijacking- a computer program will fly better then a human. Luftansa stripped theirs out of the entire fleet for fear of remote hijacking.

  30. my funny farmer…I won’t again
    suggest that what you witnessed…
    is untrue…
    The reality of the moment then becomes…
    Well, perhaps…I might know …before i Die..
    JFK…killing style…
    yea right…
    you still may email me…
    and you are saying..you were a witness to this first hand?
    then speak big time….

  31. There are many unanswered, unexplained questions about what happened. I only know what I personally heard, felt, saw. #1, you know the industry I worked in for 30 years that led me back and forth from NYC to LA. I honestly, from my experience, without a shadow of a doubt, do not believe the planes were holograms. I heard the first plane fly over, felt my building shake. My building is roughly a mile from the site (I’ve walked there many times) At the time, I had just gotten up, was having my first cup of coffee after a long night shoot, and thought “MG! What the F was that?! Geez, that plane is Too LOW!” I received a phone call from Lufkin, TX. (of all places LOL) asking me if I was OK. When I turned on the TV I couldn’t believe it was real. If you only saw it on the tube, it would be easy to think it was special effects. That’s what it looked like. So, I got my binoculars and ran 2 flights up to my roof (unobstructed panoramic view of the city). From there, I saw the second plane, the people jumping from windows, the implosion… I won’t go into the rest of the details. The sites, sounds, experiences of the hours, days (and esp. smells after the couple of weeks), are memories I truly do not want to relive. The question is the planes. I do not have the answers. I just know what I saw and I’ve done too much work with various special effects depts. and film /sound editing to believe that what I saw, heard, felt were holograms. I do believe there was a set-up, a conspiracy, and there has been a Major Cover-up (complete with plenty of missing + planted evidence).

    1. I know you believe what you saw was real, Angel, so we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

      Besides, you I’m not going to fight with (over ANYTHING)

      I like you way too much for that (even if you don’t call me anymore sniff, sniff) 😥

        1. FF, if that is what you saw, then I’m not calling you a liar and I respect your point of view. I’m sorry if I offended you, too.

          But stick with me a moment. I don’t know how holograms work, but is it possible that what you saw was a guided missile hitting the north tower – plus the explosions from pre-planted charges? And that the video footage (delayed by 17 seconds) was a cgi overlay that was broadcast to the world? Were you on the Brooklyn Bridge at the time? What _exactly_ did you see?

          The point about the planes being unable to fly so low also takes into consideration the speed. Of course planes can fly low – as you point out, they must do so in order to take off and land. But they take off and land relatively _slowly_. High speeds, like 500 mph, require thinner air, available at higher altitudes. Analysis of the broadcasted video shows the speed the “planes” were supposedly traveling was impossible at that altitude. The air is just too dense. Remotely guided planes would obviously face the same difficulty. I suspect that missiles could do the job, as that appears to be what hit the Pentagon. Let’s say an actual plane flew way too low – not at 500 mph of course — and that that’s what you and Angel and others in Manhattan saw — but the plane then released a missile, which hit the towers. The cgi bit then broadcast on tv after a 17-second delay later was total hollywood fakery.

          The lack of parts on the ground is troubling – but most of the debris appears to have been inexplicably turned to dust. But the video of the plane disappearing into the building is just not believable to _this_ patriot. Nor is the “nose-cone” shot. Hahahahahah. They screwed up that one, didn’t they? I would like you to admit that, based on the broadcast video footage, this case is not believable. It is insulting to one’s intelligence to be told that this is what an aluminum plane striking a steel-framed, concrete building looks like. Therein lies the degree of acrimony many of us display toward planers. There could indeed have been a plane (traveling more slowly), but that that video footage does not make the case. Can you understand that?

          In the end, I can see how folks think that it really doesn’t matter, but nonetheless it matters to me. It rankles me not to know every last shred of truth about that day. I still have nightmares about it. Had one last night. Our children have been wasted in war, killed, maimed, mentally ruined, unfixable shells of their former selves. Trillions of our dollars have been spent to butcher people who had nothing to do with what happened on that day. Afghanistan has been used to restart the poppy fields, and the heroin flows back to ruin our citizens’ lives. Iraq, a once beautiful country that once housed the very artifacts of the cradle of humanity, trashed before our eyes, innocents slaughtered, tortured, raped, imprisoned with no hope of release, justice a dream. Our rights at home have been trampled on, based on what happened that day. Our futures ruined, because of what happened that day. Perhaps because of our shoddy science education, our citizens believed that stupid video footage, and we lost (at least temporarily) our country. Yes, people died that day, but even more died and will die because of the way the events of that day were (mis)interpreted. Now we have neither security nor liberty, because of that day.

          I come here because I know people here care about the truth, can handle the truth, and are fighting to figure out the truth. Let’s stick together, in that spirit, eh?


          1. I thought you said you were done with this argument. I know #1 said he was.
            Your opinion is certainly valid as an eye witness and in consideration of your profession, but I think this has been pretty well hashed out.
            And by the way, I am not a keyboard warrior. The people here at From the Trenches are prepping for war.
            Arm, equip, and train as militia.

          2. My last name is Shivley, not Schivley. The name is German, not Mexican.
            All is good, we just have to remember we are all on the same side here and our arguments should bring us closer together through understanding.

  32. look funny farmer…you are becoming more funny actually not….cause not millions in NYC could have witnessed this when they had no knowledge that it was coming…….and just by the way….were tuned in on the moment…..to see the exact happening..
    I do not doubt that there are people, perhaps you are one, that witnessed this..
    And in their own mind say what they believe………
    and so it is

    1. actually read and respond to #1nwo…had to say to you and he is respectful and to the point….
      and here I am pointing this out??
      and you are still talking…
      well than have something to say!

  33. what’s your point?
    Do you think it was a hologram?
    look….I wasn’t there and if you were..
    well, then don’t back down either…
    I am a person that is about…truth….and am I perfect? No!
    Doesn’t change my being one cent…

  34. funny farmer
    more I think of this conversation..
    the funny-or I get in finding out just who you are..
    a, at best…an NY city ite…..in the plural..who is lost…
    gracious…go back home…
    and drop the curtain…
    don’t you believe it’s time!

  35. They were not commercial airliners…they were most likely Raytheon modified Skywarrior A3’s that were designed to LOOK like commercial airliners.

  36. In the Hologram video above (the first video posted in the comments) does any one else see the planes left (port) wing disappear behind the building as it flies toward the WTC building? It is at the 7 sec mark. Pause it there and you will see it. Epic digital rendering fail!

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